Don’t any of these Supervisors recognize the old truthyism (for you Stephen Colbert fans)…..You can’t DIG yourself out of a hole!

The current direction of Prince Wiliam County’s land use policies are simply unsustainable for a healthy community.  We are not, and will NEVER be, a Fairfax County, NOR do we want to be.  We must create a new vision for this county, based on OUR unique assests in Prince William County, of which there are many.  To understand the complete and utter craziness of our entire planning process, click here,and you will wonder if our county is creating just paper plans or a healthy community based in a 3D world where REAL people live.

Doesn’t our County, with its beautiful landscape, and interesting features, deserve a viable land use plan, that takes ADVANTAGE of our assets instead of just the old tired cookie cutter approach (which, by the way, got us in the current fix to begin with!)

Like Charlie Grymes said in his blog post:

The Planning Department must like the “ready-fire-aim” approach. They are recommending approvals of CPA’s now, basing their advice on the draft chapter produced by the Land Use Advisory Committee that the Planning Commission did not accept. Wow, Rube Goldberg must be their favorite designer for household furniture.

If you like unrestricted development, initiate CPA’s out of sequence with plan revisions.

If you like comprehensive planning, do not initiate any CPA’s now.


47 Thoughts to “Politicans Living in a Paper World?”

  1. There’s a big difference between politicians and leaders. And I don’t see a whole heck of a lot of wise leadership happening in this county.

  2. ShellyB

    I put my faith in the majority of the Board to steer us out of this crisis. It would help if Chairman Stewart and John Stirrup would stop thinking their duty to the citizens of PWC is to make a lot of noise in the press and otherwise just kill time between elections. Our future is at stake. We are in real trouble unless the Board starts making some wise decisions.

    If “Crackdown Corey” and his sidekick don’t know how to lead this county, they should do us all a favor and look to their colleagues for advice. Especially those who have BEEN HERE, and WILL BE HERE IN THE FUTURE. We need leadership from the Board Members who have the best interests of this county and this community at heart; not the ones who came here recently to play politics with the fate of people they don’t even really know.

  3. michael

    There are two streams of thought.

    1. One group of people who want to live serene, peaceful lifestyles with no concrete intrusions and at a moderate level of wealth (even extremely wealthy mansions and wealthy estates can be rural). These people do not want and do not need growth or aggressive zoning changes to the community. I am one of these people.

    2. A second group of people who value only glamor, large shopping malls, lots of concrete, community activities and programs that are typical of cities, but want those in the suburbs. These people want zoning that allows the most rapid industrial, entertainment and shopping growth possible.

    We need to create and SEPERATE zones for each of these types of people and maintain those community life-style objectives as city planners.
    Some people want nature and slow living, some people want glamor and rich living.

    It’s when you try to do BOTH in a community that you ruin it for everyone concerned, especially when growth in your tax base is your only objective for new zoming changes. When this happens FIRE your county planning board and start over. Villages can be just as profitable as strip malls (but take more vision) and desire for beauty rather than convenience and instant gratification of shopping pleasure.

  4. michael

    Villages also create more pleasant experiences (like wine villages), have a far lower C02 footprint, less heat generation to add to global warming and add oxygen rather than take it away from the atmosphere as do strip malls, concrete, and asphalt.

    The greatest and most rapidly decaying slums in previous suburb development concepts (row houses) are based on short lived (10-15 year) strip mall communities like PWC is trying to build.

  5. michael

    Strip mall and row house economic growth is rapid, but also decays quickly when the strip malls and row houses are not upgraded and the lifestyle is not enjoyable anymore. Villages with rural luxury or resort overtones outlast all of these.

  6. michael

    Row houses also have low skilled wage earners as the most likely first home owners, are built around factories and strip mall outlets (they decay quickly) while luxury villages and resort style rural communities have the wealthiest, and most long term permanent residents. To start these, you typically build a LAKE, a lodge, an attraction, self contained community service block, artisan block and village town center you can get to by walking or golf cart or bicycle, and mega golf courses (like “the villages” retirement community in Florida) with 32 golf courses all residents can play for free.

  7. michael

    Your home should be your garden and your art center, rather than just your bedroom and your grocery store.

  8. ShellyB

    Michael, I’m with you in group number one. I remember this term “Smart Growth” was once the slogan for our county. Which category does that fit in, one or two?

  9. Michael is lucky to have “moderate wealth.”

    However, there are some of us Plebes who would just like to keep trees and history alive.

  10. michael

    Im with you pinko on keeping trees and history alive, that is what makes Europe so charming and so worth traveling to see. Few people want to come see our suburbs, they are so ugly and crime ridden, dilapidated and disorganized. Track row and strip mall planning at its worst.

  11. michael

    I think it was an attempt at 1 Shellyb, but it obviously failed miserably to increase our standard of living and more importantly “quality of living”.

  12. michael

    Some of the poor villages I see in Alaska, are higher “quality of life” places than most places in Fairfax, Alexandria, Woodbridge and PWC’s “illegal” immigrant destroyed and abandoned homes.

  13. michael

    New York City and outlying regions is probably the worst example of this lack of city planning, track homes and strip malls, while Washington DC central (minus the slums, and track homes and outlying suburb strip malls) is probably one of the best planned cities.

  14. Elena

    blah blah blah, yawn, always the simplified answer to blame everything bad on the “others” , i.e. the “illegals” in the 21st century are the new I-talians, Irish, Jews, Poles, etc etc.@michael

  15. michael

    St Augustine, Fl and Charleston, SC come to my mind as cities with a good planning horizon, Pittsburg. PA and Portland, OR are two others, possibly Seattle, WA. The makeover of Downtown St Lousis, MO has done miracles to the waterfront, but still has a long way to go to remove the immediate slums in the city limits.

  16. michael

    You are bullying Elena (take note Monhowler, this is how a liberal mind attacks other people’s opinions without good arguments or debate). Elena give me some facts that dispute the destructive effects of “illegal” immigration on PWC.

  17. michael

    Note I used not ONE ethnic reference and SHE makes it an ethnic issue, erroneously but politically twisting the argument toward her perceptions and beliefs, thus causing the anger and hatred that others respond to as an ethnicity issue rather than a legal issue.

  18. michael

    You cannot get this wrong if you make it only an “illegal” issue.

  19. michael

    Read the book Guilty: The liberal victim attacks on America, by Ann Coulter and you will get a good understanding of what I mean by political “bullying” and not respecting others or their opinions that are balanced and presenting two sides to the issue.

  20. Elena

    Ann Coulter who said that Jews just need to be “perfected” ? Oh, Pa-Lease!

    Anyway,apparently Corey has cut people’s ability to speak at citizens time to one minute. Never, in my memory, or other people who have lived in this county much longer, did a chairman, ever so willingly cut of free speech at citizens time.

  21. DB

    A really good read is Growing Up Empty: Hunger in America. There is an entire chapter about hunger in the military, case studies done here at Quantico by the authors. Great thing about this book is that there is little focus if any on race, the authors just focus on hunger and the issues surrounding welfare.

  22. Moon-howler

    Michael, I don’t think Elena is bullying. I thinks she is disagreeing. Was it her usual genial style? No, but there have been times you have called us all stupid. I don’t think that is normally your style either.

    Bullying is harrassment, intimidation, and belittling. (and just harranguing and never getting off something) It isn’t simple disagreement. I don’t feel either Elena or Michael are bullies.

  23. Elena

    Thanks M-H, I am just especially tired these days and not my usual “patient” self. It just gets old, always having everything wrong with this country revert back to the “illegals”. The lack of productive long term planning in this county is NOT an immigration issue 🙂

  24. Second-Alamo

    Praising the virtues of illegal immigration is getting rather stale. I don’t think anyone is getting more sympathetic with time, but is instead realizing the harsh realities. Heath resources are starting to limit access based on proper immigration status as they can no longer afford to treat everyone. Clinics in California are closing left and right due to the overload from illegals. The shame is that now our citizens won’t have a clinic to go to, and they are the ones footing the bill.

  25. Moon-howler

    SA, no one here is praising the virtues of illegal immigration. You know better than that! Calling for comprehensive immigration reform is not praising illegal immigration, regardless of how hard those on the dark screen attempt to paint the debate as an either/or situation.

    Realizing that deportation is simply not practical option, many of us want to explore other avenues to deal with the problems of illegal immigration.

    Every ill in the country is not a direct result of illegal immigration.

  26. Second-Alamo

    Somehow if I lived in Phoenix I think I’d disagree with you! Most of their problems are a direct result of illegal immigration. As far as praising illegal immigration, I was more or less directing that at Elena as she seems to be so hung up on the ethnicity undertone. It seems to blind her to the bigger picture that is reality.

  27. Elena

    Please, I am hung up on it?! This thread was about land use, and somehow, inevetably, the “illegals” come up! I wonder, why are YOU referencing Phoenix SA? What is special about Phoenix and immigration as opposed to someplace like New York City? WHat does Greg and ilk almost always talk about when they discuss the “illegals”? Let me enlighten you, they talk about those dirty uncultured mexicans who are ruining our American way of life. Don’t play dumb with me, it isn’t becoming on someone who I consider pretty intelligent. Geez, every crime committed in this county if you read the “dark” blog would seem to originate from someone the a hispanic surname, DESPITE the fact that only 1.6% of people coming through the criminal justic system in PWC are not properly documented. AND of those crimes, they are primarly misdemeanors!

    Hasn’t the failed experiment of PWC demonstrated anything? We invested millions of dollars to prove that THERE has to be a different way to deal with immigration.

  28. Second-Alamo


    How can we deal with the issue of illegal immigration when this country is prevented from even asking for immigration status, and yet is forced to provide tax payer funded services regardless. The first step is determining who is and is not legally in this country. Why is this so difficult to accept? When police were going to question people about their immigration status many here shouted it down as if it was some inhumane method. It’s easier to repeat “but how do you know they’re illegal?” as a defense when you prevent that question from being answered, and that is the only defense given.

  29. Moon-howler

    SA, it needs to be dealt with at the federal level, starting with a secure border. I am a realist. I know that we cannot secure every inch of our extremely long borders around this country. However, we need to do a better job than we are doing now.

    We need comprehensive immigration reform. I am not saying that our cops cannot ask about status, but they shouldn’t be stopping people for that purpose. Our local police cannot take over the role of border control or ICE.

    The disagreement and debate should be centered around the policies in the immigration reform, not whether to restructure our policy or not.

  30. Moon-howler

    SA, my problem with ‘how do you know they’re illegal?’ is that so many times people see a Latino surname and immediately the ‘illegal’ remarks start being made. There are several examples in the readers’ comments section in yesterday’s regarding the homicide over near route 1.

  31. Poor Richard

    Good old Charlie Grymes. The only person I know who can give a
    group tour of the Manassas Battlefield area on foot and
    talk about history, plants, animals, geology and long range
    land use planning AND have it be interesting and informative
    with more than a little humor and wit.

  32. Elena

    Charlie IS awesome Poor Richard, I agree 🙂

  33. michael

    Talk about politicians living in a paper world….

    I just posted this on and I hope Obama’s staff is reading it and smart enough to do something about it.

    This economic crisis has hit my community in ways I never thought possible in America. It has changed my political life, my community involvement, and significantly reduced my optimism for any healthy economy and global status I feel the US has given over to international interests.

    Like many in my community I saw it coming before many in positions of government leadership did. Our housing market collapsed in my community around June 2007, and then bad things began to run underground in the financial market without any of us seeing it, but noticed it first in the stock markets rapid collapse 10-15 Sep 2008, when I sold every stock I had and moved everything I owned into the FDIC protected bank and Money Market funds (I kept wishing I could get out of 401K and IRA accounts without penalties) and thinking WHAT caused that? Why the wide-scale abuse of hedge funds and short selling? Why are banks refusing to lend money to each other, are they not BANKS anymore? I first became aware of the housing problems and collapse of housing as I saw my community demographics change from a predominantly upper middle income neighborhood to a predominantly low income neighborhood in an extremely short period of time (4 years). The demographics of my community changed as well, from a community of lawful and law abiding citizens to an extremely rapid influx of “illegal” aliens that had utter disregard for the law. This rapid influx had extremely negative effects on my community. It reduced the overall median income, increased significantly the presence of extremely dangerous gangs (SU-13, MS-13, LJC, and others), increased community architectural covenant violations, disregarded community zoning and building code laws, and created slum-like living conditions and appearances in neighborhoods who property values sky-rocketed with initial demand and then plummeted with the decline in overall community appearance and decrease in wealth. So many of us wondered what the root cause of such rapid decline in our community standard of living was at the heart of such rapid changes. First in the town of Herndon Virginia, then throughout Prince William County Virginia, residents saw a significant increase in loitering, and panhandling for low income jobs, with an effect that angered citizens because of the trash, public urination, graffiti, harassment of business owners, and decrease in citizen safety and security in vacant lots adjacent to these places of loitering. Citizen’s began to demand enforcement of existing laws to remove this obvious decline in community values and appearances, that affected the profitability of local businesses and the price of median income homes as multiple families and individual “illegal” immigrants began to turn single family dwellings into cheap apartments for rent by word of mouth and exterior cultural signals. Citizens in our community began to be aware there was a political element deeply entrenched in government positions of authority that advocated for and defended political activities based on favorable treatment and legal protection of targeted “protected class” ethnicities, genders, races and religions, that became even more important than enforcing the existing community laws on all citizens the same. These political leaders represented many family members of previously “illegal” aliens that were given amnesty in 1986, and over a 25 year period slowly began to exercise their political views based on ethnicity, and ignoring the US constitution, the laws against prejudice and racial advantages of one ethnic group over another, rather than treating each human being as an individual without any preference or discrimination entirely on ethnicity, gender, race, and religion. I noticed people in our community, and in positions of political power began to advocate only for their own political advantage based on ethnicity, gender, race and religion, rather than equal fairness of the law to all individuals the same. This problem started with the establishment of “protected classes, HUD programs and 8A policies and unfair contracting policies of the Small Business Association (SBA). It became obvious to all of us in our community, that open advocacy for ethnic privilege, and blatant preferences given to ethnicities, and refusal to execute the existing law for criminal prosecution of “illegal” immigrants, was the root cause of the housing demand, population explosion, demographic changes, income changes and increase on community social services and educational burden. It became obvious that real estate brokers were giving preference in home sales and mortgage applications to “illegal” aliens and formerly “illegal” aliens, because the community demographics changed in such a one-sided way, low-income jobs changed demographics in such a one sided way, and brokerage firms, banks, car dealers and businesses, were widely posting notices in languages many of who have lived in the US all of our lives, cannot understand. Without a common language binding people together, and without a common law that ensured all of us were “legal” and should be able to trust and respect one other as individuals, we saw instead wide spread evidence of competing ethnic groups for social prevalence, social recognition, social advantages and social self-segregation along lines of ethnicity, gender, race and religion. It is these very same activities that created the segregations of the past between white and black communities in the late 1950’s. I was incredulously witnessing a return to the 1950’s social problems, but now caused by ethnicities who had been in the US less than 5 or 10 years and who cared nothing for common law, respect for the law, or respect for common rights of individuals to be treated not as competing ethnic groups but as competing individuals.
    Instead of deciding on federal funding and AID from HUD, 8A, Fannie MAE, Freddie MAC, and community social services for individuals, it was obvious specific ethnic groups were sought out and targeted for help and mortgage assistance. It became obvious we had no system to separate “legal” people from “illegal” people, and the result of 25 years of refusing to enforce the law on “illegal” immigrants, created an open arrogance and lack of fear of prosecution that fueled massive false reporting of income to debt ratios on mortgage applications, false address reporting, false credit reporting and false mortgage insurance credit rating on loans made in the sub-prime high risk areas. Loans were not made based on “income level” but based on ethnicity, gender, racial and religious preference, something I never thought I would see in America.
    You already know the rest of the story. It took me 4 months of listening to congressional hearing to figure it out.

    When income levels dropped as the “illegals” in my community lost construction, painting and landscaping jobs (because people recognized the unfair charging of skilled labor overheads, while hiring lower income workers of less skill) and businesses failed that were based on the hiring of “illegal” immigrant labor, in the summer of 2007, most of the “illegal” immigrants and former “illegal” immigrant families who bought homes using 8A and HUD assistance were unable to keep up their highly over-leveraged mortgage payments. They were able to rationalize their over-leveraging position by thinking they could recover this in a sale of the home at any time that would always increase in value, as long as they could offered their homes out for rent to family members who were illegal and other contacts who were illegal, they ignored federal statutes making it a criminal offense to harbor or transport “illegal” aliens, in order to help them support the monthly mortgage payment on the mortgage they took out for others, or themselves while sub-letting to others on single family homes governed by single family home zoning laws, and building codes. This situation existed in 4 of the 9 homes that were in my immediate cul-de-sac. When 4.5 million of the 12 million “illegal” immigrants and 35 million formerly “illegal” immigrants defaulted on 50% of the existing sub-prime loans, the banks went into a panic, because they were left with no income, had no capital reserves to cover the losses, and were left holding foreclosed homes whose values declined by the alterations made on them by the “illegal” tenants who sub-let, or lived as individual renters in what used to be upper-middle income, and middle income homes, that used to have upper middle income and middle income home values.

    Who is to blame for the world wide economic melt-down? Everyone who refused to execute the existing law and prevent some 45 million “illegal” immigrants from creating a run away population bubble that fueled housing demand, and created ethnic-centric fraud on a wide-scale basis.

    Congress is to blame for refusing to enforce this law with adequate funding for law enforcement, by pushing organizational policies that prevented then from arresting, locating, identifying, prosecuting and deporting 45 million “illegal” immigrants over a 25 year period. Congress is to blame for refusing to support DHS policy, and supporting non-discriminating community safety and welfare charters for community law enforcement to enforce law in every community in the US.
    Congress is to blame for refusing to help people of “low income”, especially rural America, who lost jobs to foreign labor and foreign exploitation by US companies and by choosing instead to help people of specific ethnic political action groups rather than people of specific “income levels”.

    Congress is to blame for allowing the mortgage insurance industry to advocate for and obtain legislation that would permit the creation of limited capital reserves in banks, the creation of derivative products that were executed using “mark to market” rules on securities that had no underlying capital value because their was a buyer, a seller and a promise to pay a premium or interest rate between those two legal entities, that was a “fixed” capital value, over a fixed interval of time. This allowed the speculative and over-valued lunacy of market rules to be ignored for banks in terms of capital reserve requirements, the creation of a “securities insurance” industry that promised to pay losses on derivative products, with no concern for their actual capital value or “book value” based on traditional accounting practices. Such speculation artificially inflated the market, way above its underlying capital worth, and as we all know markets that are inflated drastically correct. The other lunacy was refusal to apply traditional accounting practices to hedge funds, and credit default swap securities that only had reserves to pay 10-15% losses, and no underlying capital basis securing those products I call “vapor paper”. This type of market concept and “mark to market” risk is highly volatile, especially when the securities traded are rated as AAA or low risk, when in reality they are created by the riskiest segment of the entire population, the population of “illegal” immigrants and formerly “illegal” immigrants in the US who have no regard for law or ethical behavior, or aversion to the commitment of wide-spread fraud.

    Congress is to blame for not enforcing the law, and not providing adequate law enforcement oversight, and refusal to prosecute and deport those who willingly and without remorse continue to defraud our community and receive assistance in commitment of fraud from the ethnic focused businesses and family members who support only their own ethnicity above and beyond any accountability to the law.

    The bottom line is this: fraud and illegal behavior at all levels of government, business and the community caused a global meltdown.
    The other bottom line is this: I was a Republican and now I am a Democrat. I refuse to ever put my money in “vapor paper” ever again, and will only purchase capital that is owned free and clear by only me and no one else. I refuse to left someone else to “borrow it” sell it on the market, and then pay me back later as they pocket the short sales profits on my capital asset, affecting the market VALUE of my capital asset that only I should hold. I will not do business with anyone who practices ethnic preference, and I will politically fight anyone who continues to force policy to help and support “protected classes” while they ignore all individuals of “needy” low income levels, because they prefer to help only those of specific races, genders, religions or ethnicities. I will not trust the government, the congress or the President, if they do not punish, persecute, fire and jail, ALL people who committed fraud in mortgage sub-prime loans (the “illegals” and the “ethnic centric brokers who favored only their own ethnicities enough to help them commit fraud) and ALL individuals at the heads of companies and management teams, and in the government today, who looked the other way, knowing these securities were extremely high risk, while they lined their pockets with speculative profits, got paid bonuses for failure, and got bailed out by the US government and the individual taxpayer, ME. If you do not get my money back, breaks up the companies that are “TOO BIG TO FAIL as anti-trust violations, and let these companies corrupt business units FAIL based on free market principles, so that other new companies based on higher ethical standards can grow and flourish: Then I will do everything in my power and take back my country with a grass roots effort, to ensure the ENTIRE Congress and Senate is CHANGED OUT in the next election. If you value your privileged jobs, you should listen to this good advice and LEAD rather than accept corruption, poor ethics, and lawlessness as a “normal course of doing business”.

  34. michael

    Moonhowler, I call bad behavior stupid, never people. There is a huge difference between targeting people and targeting bad behavior for reprimand.

  35. michael

    And yes Moonholwer local police should and can take over the role of enforceing existing law to protect the entire community, from the “obvious” problems of “illegal” immigration. And yes you can over time deport everyone who has broken the law, and tell them to come back only under the conditions of lawfulness.

    It is because we have not asked the question “are you illegal” at every traffic stop, that we have gotten into this mess of a failed world economy. Only a blind person would see that allowing existing “illegal” immigrants to remain in the US without punishment for their crime of defrauding the rest of us and hugely impacting the general welfare of the rest of us, would wish for more of the same to continue. Enforceing the border will not solve the problem, because over 50% of the “illegal” people in our country do not come in “over the border”, they come in by plane, and are not checked in their illegal status in every community in the US at every traffic stop. This continued “ignorant behavior” is STUPID.

  36. Moon-howler

    Securing the border would be a good place to start though. As for people overstaying their visa, perhaps the penalty for doing that needs to get much stiffer.

  37. Elena

    Michael you said:

    “Who is to blame for the world wide economic melt-down? Everyone who refused to execute the existing law and prevent some 45 million “illegal” immigrants from creating a run away population bubble that fueled housing demand, and created ethnic-centric fraud on a wide-scale basis.”

    Now THAT is classic scapegoating if I ever saw one! Some of the most vulberable and poor class of our community is at fault for the “global meltdown”?! That is simply untrue.

  38. Elena

    I found this commentarty on another website. I thought I would post it here so that people could read what I found incredibly shocking.

    “They deserve a lot of the blame but not all of it, In January the sec. of H.U.D. gave a press release which saw zero mainstream media attention. It was stated that of the current 12 million mortgages in default/foreclosure 5 million were loans made to illegal aliens from mexico. These were predominately in California, Arizona, Nevada, Colorado and Florida in roughly 30 separate counties. Stockton California the epicenter of the housing debacle was exposed on 60 minutes and highlighted black and white families as the victims of predatory loans.

    The truth was that the majority of the defaults were that of migrant workers (illegal mexican aliens) who stole equity from the homes along with all of the plumbing, cabinetry and electrical fixtures down to the copper wire in the walls then returned to mexico with all of the loot.

    Municipalities all across the nation are going broke because of services rendered to mexicans such as; welfare, education, hospitalization, tuition and incarceration. The loss of revenue due to a failure in collecting taxes on under the table wages for illegals and the remittance of said wages back to mexico starves local economies of billions of dollars that would otherwise create jobs here. It was estimated the over $40 billion left the U.S. annually via wire transfer to mexico.

    Housing prices were artificially inflated as groups of 20-30 illegal aliens collectively purchased houses bidding them up far past their legitimate value.
    Kicking in only $150 each large groups of illegals were offered huge interest only arms by countrywide and bank of America and many of us in California closed our BofA accounts because of these practices back in 2007.
    This made it nearly impossible for 1 or 2 income families to afford to buy a house without an interest only ARM or other shady mortgage deals.

    Couple the extreme housing prices with the high cost of health care and you have a big problem. Health care debts account for the majority of bankruptcies in the U.S. and these health care costs are also the responsibility of illegal aliens who use the system and don’t pay into it. In California nearly every person in the Emergency room is an illegal getting free health care.

    Eliminate the housing crisis and the health care problems companies like Fannie, Freddie, AIG and Bear Stearns would still be solvent even with the crazy credit default swaps business. Ford, GM and Chrysler are dying because of retiree and union negotiated health care premiums for current employees.

    This would have not have happened so soon (although inevitable) if illegals had not been pouring in to the U.S. for the last 40 years.

    Illegal aliens are responsible for this mess as the “bull in the china shop” but it was most likely the jew who let him out of the corral.
    TOLERANCE is the virtue of a man without convictions. -G.K. Chesterton “

  39. Elena

    For those who may want to believe the retold lies of someone posting on a neo nazi website, let me direct you to this more accurate analysis:

    “With Tom Tancredo no longer running for president, Michele Malkin has stepped forward to set the record straight: “illegal immigration, crime-enabling banks, and open-borders Bush policies fueled the mortgage crisis.”

    The shocking conclusive evidence? Apparently, a lot of Hispanics live in some of the places with high foreclosure rates.

    Malkin first cites that recently nearly half of home mortgage loans to Hispanics were subprime loans. She also tosses out an unrelated statistic that one-quarter of subprime loans are in default (the figure is actually about 19 percent). But do these two statistics connect to lay blame on illegal immigrants — and in her mind, are all Hispanics undocumented workers?

    And the loans in default — are those just the ones made to borrowers without immigration papers? Apparently the connection is so obvious that nary a shred of evidence is needed, we are just supposed to know that “it’s no coincidence.”

    Never mind that the real data contradicts what we are all supposed to know.

    An exhaustive study of 1.9 million subprime loans showed “roughly 56 percent went to non-Hispanic whites. Affluent borrowers, those with annual income at least 120 percent of their given area’s median income, meanwhile, took out more than 39 percent of the loans.” According to the same study, “Hispanics constituted 14 percent of the borrower community and received 20 percent of the subprime loans.”

    In other words, the vast majority of borrowers getting subprime loans — and therefore most of those going into default — were not Hispanics, let alone illegal immigrants.”

  40. Elena

    HUD denies this false report of 5 million bad mortgages being held by “illegal immigrants”

  41. michael

    Hud is lying about who bought them, the holders are foreign banks and US lenders who made HUD 8A mortgaages to 4.5 million “illegals” and former “illegal” immigrants.

  42. michael

    HUD has no category for “illegal” vs “legal” in ANY of its data, the reliable data comes from sources inside the FBI, Department of Justice and other data that does track illegal behavior, so there is NO WAY they can claim they have data that supports there were NOT some 4.5 million “illegals” and former “illegals” involved in these frauds and defaults.

    The citizens LIVING in these communities ALSO know better!

  43. michael

    Geithner said the sub-prime default rate was at 50%, this was corroborated on C-Span.

  44. michael

    What you ignore on your data is the demographics of the number of people who “defaulted”. 50% of the TOTAL number of subprimes defaulted (That is what put Bear Sterns and AIG out of business), they had only planned to pay and insure 10-15% of the subprimes. Of this 50%, the vast majority of these loans were to people who had very low income levels. The people with the lowest income levels in the US are “illegal” immigrants and former “illegal” immigrants, who also made up the MAJORITY (100-56%=44% non-whites) who took out of the people who DEFAULTED on these loans (some 4.5 million people DEFAULTED, some 15 Million did not. The majority of sub-prime holders DID NOT default, because they had the higher income levels. Those are the people who hold the Non-defaulted subprimes you mention in the above statistics. Roughly 50% of the sub-prime loans made in the US according to Geithner and others reporting on C-Span DEFAULTED, that is roughly some 4.5 million foreclosures.
    In addition when you only sample 1.9 million mortgages out of the total number of mortgages, you can also be selective in your sample enough to bias the results toward how you want to report it. The answer to how you can trust this report is to find out WHO conducted the study? Bet you a MILLION it was a “pro-illegal” immigration advocacy group.

  45. michael

    Not all of the defaults were sub-prime mortgages either, a certain percentage were also 30 year fixed. No-one knows the total NUMBER of mortgages that foreclosed, only the rough percentages.

  46. Elena

    You sound desperate to make the case that the “illegals” are at fault Michael.

    In any event, I found the commentary on the neo-nazi website, posted a few comments up, very disturbing.

Comments are closed.